Aline Bianchi

Helvetiarockt is a Swiss national association raising awareness about gender inequality in the music industry while supporting promoting and connecting professional female inter non-binary and trans artists. Through its grassroots projects such as producing, DJing, band workshops and songwriting camps, it offers platforms for young people of all levels to discover music and be part of an empowering community find out more on our website helvetiarockt.ch, sign up for the newsletter and follow us on social media. Musicians in Conversation is sponsored by SUISA The Cooperative Society of Music authors and Publishers in Switzerland SUISA is celebrating its 100 year anniversary in 2023. [Music] hi everyone my name is Natalia and I'm a presenter content creator and DJ in this episode I talk with Aline Bianchi who is the founder and product manager of Norma music we talk about royalties copyright licensing and synchronization and Aline also gives advice to artists planning a release we talk about setting up her company normal music and discuss ideas to solve some of the unique challenges of working in the Swiss music industry Aline answers an audience question and don't forget if you have a question simply send a direct message to Helvetiarockt on Instagram in the meantime here's my conversation with Aline Hi this is Aline Bianchi and you're listening to Helvetiarockt Musicians in Conversation hi Aline thank you so much for joining me on Helvetiarockt Musicians in Conversation. hi Nat thank you for inviting me I'm very happy to be here that's my absolute pleasure I'm going to start the interview with the question that I ask everybody and that is how did you get started on your musical Journey oh I've always been very passionate about music but I am not a musician myself after graduating University I decided to change completely my career and try to enter in the music business and I basically moved to London and that's where I started my journey in the music industry and I've been doing it now since about six seven years wonderful I mean immediately I am interested in your experiences in London what was that like moving that first of all where are you from oh I am from Ticino a very small Valley in North Ticino and I did study in Lausanne but I wanted to move abroad I wanted to go in a and dynamic capital of music and London was an obvious choice for me so how did you find it was it like a bit of a culture shock because London can be quite intense to be honest no I don't know maybe in a past life I was living in a hectic city but I just feel felt very comfortable I settled in quite easily and you know I just loved that there were so many people from different backgrounds different nationalities and just the music scene there it's so amazing and so varied and yeah I mean I there was no time no space to feel scared or uncomfortable you just jump right in yes absolutely the way that you got to London you were just sending out like application forms like sort of cold contacts yes yes exactly so after uni I gave myself like a deadline what I said that if within six months I don't find a music job I'll go back to do what I did before so yeah I sent a lot of applications and luckily a company got back to me I actually sent a spontaneous application there there was not really a job ad and that company if I can say was PIAS which is a distributor and artist services company with HQ in London but it's present a bit internationally and they needed somebody to help in the royalties Department which is basically the department that takes care of all the royalty statements for artists so basically yeah all the sales that artists make physically or online and yeah it was a bit of an admin and repetitive job but it got me into the music industry was kind of my step into the industry which is the most important part absolutely and I just want to kind of like get into that part of things because just to maybe inspire people who are listening that that is a way forward, like to maybe not be afraid to just reach out to companies or organizations I mean what was the kind of nitty-gritty of it did you what sort of research went into what you did before sending these emails. initially it was mainly looking for labels that I related to in terms of roster and I knew I wanted to stay a bit of in the Indie side I didn't really apply to major labels and there for example I think it was a mix of just being at the right place at the right time and I did I did I didn't know anything about royalties like zero and I'm I basically prepared myself for the interview by doing some research about the UK collecting societies how they work what are the basic rules of copyright and I think at the interview I remember my manager back then was just very impressed about how I knew about those things where nobody really gets interested about those aspects in the music industry because they think either it's boring or it's too complicated so I guess if you do your research and you show that you really care and you're committed and just you know you show you you're ready to learn, even if you come from a completely different background because I studied hotel management that are completely different you can do it at the end of the day companies especially in the music Industries are looking for people who are forward-thinking, are creative, are positive and yeah that's what matters I guess that's great piece of advice for people I love that I love that because sometimes you think oh it's too late or maybe I can't do it no no don't do that it's good to keep pushing and learn new things and get out of your comfort zone if you can so I want to go into the copyright side of things I think you're quite a unique person that we can talk with on this podcast because like you said it's not like the sexy part of music no it's not first of all what is royalties let's just break it right down for people like what is royalties what is copyright are they the same thing like can you give us definitions first of all okay I'm not an expert in legal definitions but basically copyright is just the way you can protect your music it's a legal stamp in a way royalties basically music is a piece of work and you can exploit the rights to that work to generate revenue in different forms through licensing, sales and so forth so there's different types of royalties depending on what type of right you have on the piece of music and the most known ones is there the copyright on the production so the composition of the song and then the other part is on the actual recordings on the master and those are the biggest type of copyright that are exploited when using musical works. Are people still like back in my day like we used to record a song and then post it to ourselves okay and that was just like you do a recorded delivery so you've got a song you burn it onto a CD and then you set go to the Post Office get it stamped recorded delivery you send it back to your own home address but then you never open the envelope and that was supposed to be you can go to court overall say this is my song I wrote it I actually didn't know people did that it's the first time I hear it oh my God girlfriend this is what we did back in the day but no I don't know like I've done it I swear to God I've got an unopened envelope with a CD of my music but and that was to say like this is a copy written and I don't know where I heard it from somebody told me to do that I don't know if that was an old wives tale if that's really true of a way of copyrighting your music but for people now nowadays making music what is the way to copyright it. From one side it's always good to have some sort of written agreement especially with people maybe you're working with who's making the music with you so that in case the music gets at some point used and sold you know who's getting which piece of the pie and then obviously registering it with a collecting Society in your country so for example in Switzerland we have SUISA and Swiss perform those are also help because they ask who is the copyright owners who has shares to or who is entitled to shares of the master right or the composition and that is I think that is the first thing that I suggest doing then by law in the moment you write you finish writing something you compose something by law it is already copyrighted music gets copyrighted as soon as it gets recorded cool so that's like when you've recorded it like on your yeah even in your phone if you're like yeah I mean that there is a physical proof that you're performing that song yes there might be other steps to be doing on a legal from a legal point of view that I'm not aware of but so far this is what I've been dealing with in my job so far that's very interesting so in terms of like when you said a piece of the pie I'm definitely thinking a circular thing and I'm thinking percentages so we are saying like say I am the person maybe who originated the song in terms of like I've come up with a riff and and some lyrics so maybe I own fifty percent of it and then distribute the rest exactly throughout the band exactly yeah it's because very often the person who writes the lyrics is not the same who writes the actual composition and so it's good to get this regulated written down and agreed with before a campaign starts for example because then it might get complicated down the line if we never know what if that song gets a sync deal and then you're still there maybe the sync deal gets put on hold because you haven't agreed before about who gets what and you could lose the opportunity for example oh my God wow that is very interesting and let's get into it so what is a sync deal what is that oh synchronization basically is if your song gets featured in an ad or in a movie so basically your licensing that song for a visual purpose licensing a song for a visual purpose what does that process look like for an independent artist is it that they've written a song are they putting it on SoundCloud is someone finding them or are they proactively searching for syncing opportunities I mean I'm still trying to figure that out myself what is the best way to do it but there are those people called music supervisors that might work at agencies or film companies that are constantly scouting for music to feature in movies or are scouting for songwriters to compose original compositions so honestly I think it's a mix of everything you might be discovered at a concert and you're just lucky that there is a person there that kind of heard about you and then gets convinced by listening to your songs live it depends but obviously if you have a team around you as an independent artist that can create these connections contact music supervisors that really helps obviously because it is a bit of the ultimate goal in a way that we know that sync at least from my experience are the way one of the ways to generate most money for musicians yeah that's what I'm hearing that's where the money is at right now yes yeah also I forgot to mention also for video games so you can sync music for video games which is a big thing as well wow do you think artists or bands or musicians should try and make music for like with the intention that this is something that will be synced is that is it worth as a way of having it yeah I mean of course I mean if it doesn't compromise with your Creative Vision obviously if you're a pop artist that creates very relatable songs very poppy that are that express certain feelings and have certain lyrics that maybe are trendy at the moment those are maybe easier to sync so but if your style of music it's very unique and diverse and doesn't fit really into very common genres it might be a bit harder to get those things but that doesn't mean you have to completely change your style for that obviously yeah some artists maybe have more advantage than others of course yeah yeah going back to like royalties and things I'm just I'm using your brain I'm using your brain ones but yeah I mean it's been a while since I worked in royalty so I try to remember most of them honestly honestly we don't get a lot of times to talk to somebody with a bit of a background like yours and we are going to get onto what you're working on now but I just want to pick your brain what should artists know about royalties about music royalties if you were just gonna give someone a quick kind of overview what should they be keeping in mind I know it is a bit hard maybe to envision this but because artists are very attached to the music but you have to try and see music also from a business point of view it is a piece of work that you in order to make money from it at the end of the day you need to exploit that piece of work so you need to license it you need to sell it you need to try and make it work and make generate money for you so that you can keep making music so I guess getting a basic understanding of royalties and of the financial economical ecosystem of music actually works I think it will make you feel more confident in your musical journey and music career and will also show two potential business opportunities we might have in the future that you know your things and that you're prepared and that you're not you also are gonna probably avoid getting tricked maybe or you know you never know what who's out there so my advice is learn your royalties basics always think about getting your basic agreements down with whoever you're collaborating and yeah and try to look a bit of the at the business side of music too you need to diversify the way you're selling or distributing your music as I said it's not just about putting it on streaming services but you need to make sure you create a good live show that you so you can get you know you can get gigs you can get invited to festivals so you can generate money from live as well then of course try to create a good brand out of yourself so that on your socials and on your any other online channels you might want to build fans can understand who you are and can relate to you and become interested in what you're doing and then there's also the part of try to collaborate with other artists as well so that you create more opportunities and you might reach other fans that you might have not reached otherwise I think to set up yourself for success as an artist you really need to have your hands is that a term to say your hands in many pies yes how you say in English yes there you go you really need to be proactive and diversify because at the end of the day you're investing in yourself and in your music so you need to really try to touch every possibility you get and I know it's hard to do it on your own so if you have if you have the chance to build a small team around you people who can help you structure your plan and your vision that is always great If you are involved in music as a hobby profession or both sign up for free on the Helvetiarockt music directory. It's a platform for women, non-binary, trans and intersex people in the Swiss music industry. For singers, instrumentalists, bookers, managers, sound engineers, photographers and many more of all levels. It's about visibility, it's about community, it's about empowerment. We invite all of you to participate in the project. For further information go to musicdirectory.ch [Music] you are the head or the product manager at Norma Music, this is your own company can you tell us what Norma Music is yes so basically Norma Music we are a service company for independent artists in a few words we can say that we activate as a label for artists that don't have a label and we provide different types of services from release planning to online marketing distribution and basically we want to help independent artists which with whichever area they don't feel confident with and they might need help with so they can pick in a way what service they need so we kind of create a very tailored partnership with them and we decided to do this because we really love what we were doing in London I'm talking about we because it's a company I co-founded with my partner and we both were working in the music industry in London so we kind of wanted to keep doing what we loved back then but in Switzerland and instead of finding an opportunity somewhere else maybe at another label or another I don't know distribution company we decided to build something of our own obviously it's still at the very beginning and we have a very long-term vision for it and we hope we can do only that in the future but yeah we're really excited about how we got started so far I love it and what I love about it is that what you said about having a bespoke kind of service so people can contact you like independent artists can contact you and they might not need the full-blown label treatment they might just need help with one specific thing and you can come in and help them with that yeah exactly so our main idea at least for now is that we didn't want to take any share of sales or any share of copyright from artists so this is why it's a paper service kind of model right now so that whatever happens as a consequence of the collaboration with the artist it stays with the artist and we are specialized at least so far in working with artists they're at the very beginning so either it's artists that decided to start a completely new musical project maybe were in another band before or artists that have never released anything and it's their first EP or their first real proper campaign and we kind of guide them through the process let's say that's so wonderful to have because I know that for some artists it's quite an isolating experience especially if you're not in a band or anything like that if it's just by yourself you don't really have much time or much feedback from other people yes that's right so far we worked with on two campaigns and one is still ongoing and so far what I've noticed is that artists really appreciate having someone to talk to and to exchange and brainstorm and ask for opinion because especially at the beginning you're questioning everything there are so many possibilities out there and so many ways you can plan your release that it can be overwhelming and it's in a way it's good that the artist focuses on the music on creative and nice life set and let's maybe the more operational administrative and strategic side to somebody else so that it takes a lot of brain power you know it does you mentioned about when artists are releasing music what do they need to consider what are some of the things they need to consider when planning a release I always say to start as early as you can because you need to at least that's my advice get all your creative assets ready before you start the campaign before you start saying that you have a new song coming out next week because once the campaign starts you're going to be busy with a lot of other things so get your Creative Vision in place before so already have the single cover and the EP or album cover done already start if you're planning to make vinyl and CCD already get your quotes in before because you know manufacturing times right now are very long and at least like this having your base already decided it's gonna first of all make your life easier because you're not gonna be able to doubt what you did or change your mind last minute and at the same time you can focus on other aspects like I don't know social media content contacting venues and just being active on other fronts let's say should they have like a social media plan like how often to update like it doesn't have to be that even that fought out to that extent yeah I'm a bit of a planning maniac I'm not saying I'm not saying you have to plan every little detail because you never know you might have to change something last minute things happen but have at least a base there when you know in which week of the month you want to announce that your single is coming out in which week of the month you're gonna release the track in which one the video and so forth and so that you can prepare yourself on which channels you need to actually update this information on should it be on your website or on your social media so yeah have plans for everything if you can so you your life will be easier later [Music] what do you love about your job that it's every day it's different and also the fact that I'm able to work with artists that make completely different music and so there's different needs different Creative Visions to come up with different type of messaging and it's just fun that it's always so varied and there's some artists that maybe are more comfortable with social media some that hate it some there are great I don't know music production some that maybe need more help so it's nice that every artist we work with has different needs and different Visions also an aspect that it's a bit challenging sometimes but it's also very rewarding is that we have a very close relationship with our artists so sometimes I also feel a bit of a psychologist and you know you have to be you have to have that special way of saying certain things and you have to be careful because at the end of the day the artists are very close to their art and you need to still be able to put their vision forward despite maybe they might have some some you know visions that might not be right for them so it's hard maybe to convince them of something else so it is also a lot about being there emotionally absolutely oh my God yeah yeah I can totally see that you were in London you got a lot of your work experience working in the industry music industry in the UK in London specifically and then you decided to come back home to Ticino and start your own company that is a huge undertaking what have been some of the challenges first of all of doing something like that first of all I would like to clarify that we're not self-sufficient yet so I still have another job on the side where the beginning we're not financially independent yet. I guess the biggest challenge was to get used to how the Swiss music industry works because it is quite different from what I've experienced in the UK and also maybe the difficulty that I that I saw was the language differences I would love if everything will be just done in English so yeah getting to understand how the German part works in terms of music scene or the French part and their differences between themselves so are you saying that it's not just the language that's different it's also the way in which people in these various scenes work within the music industry I mean I can't really say for sure but I'm I still see them a bit separate I don't know maybe I'm wrong but finding for example a PR company that does whole Switzerland it's bit hard for example I see maybe some that focus more on the German part. Some focus more on the French part because at the end of the day it's true if you're writing a press release for an artist you're gonna write it you have to write it in German and then in French and maybe not everybody is comfortable with that or has the right connections for that so to me the language is the fact that there's so many languages in Switzerland is a bit of a disadvantage when it comes to the music scene and the music industry and for artists as well to be presented to present themselves in the whole country as a whole that is very interesting does it limit the growth of an artist the potential for an artist or band to be sort of known throughout Switzerland is that what it is yeah yeah maybe a little bit especially if you're starting at the beginning there's maybe blogs that only write in in German that may be a potential fan in the French area wouldn't understand so many maybe they discover about an artist that only gets interviewed in German because it's from the German part but so maybe you will not have as many fans in another part of Switzerland that doesn't understand German for example yeah yeah so what do you think a solution could be like you did mention like it would be so much easier if it was done in English I mean I'm an English speaker we're on a Swiss podcast but we're doing it in English just so that we could reach everyone like that's what yeah that was a conscious decision from the part of Helvetiarockt that we wanted the podcast to be accessible to people throughout Switzerland and this is great yeah is that something do you think that could be rolled out in terms of operators within the industry or would it be better just to say for example you know say if there's a PR company based in the German-speaking part of Switzerland saying Zurich should they employ somebody who is within their company but they speak fluent French or Italian for example maybe that could be a solution or just maybe also make it okay that we can promote an artist in Switzerland only in English so that not the fact the fact that maybe publication receives a press release in English doesn't mean that the artist will be completely scratched just to make it okay and acceptable to communicate about a release in one language instead of three yeah I guess it was just a way not to limit possibilities for everybody maybe just that but you know it's not me who has the power to decide this is we all have to agree it has to be a computer decision what do I listen right we've decided me and Aline no but I hear what you're saying I hear what you're saying it is such a unique experience I think that the Swiss market is quite a unique place because of the language and cultures that are just in this in this small country but there's so many different languages and cultures to consider it makes it What do some of the artists that you've worked with what do they think are they trying to like hit up different parts of Switzerland or are they just like you know what I'll be happy just here or are they thinking like even globally like it's not even just Switzerland they're trying to reach I mean the artists we've been working with are very very small so it is staying quite local for now but I don't scratch the idea of sending a pitch or a press release to a French publication if the artist is from the German part or vice versa especially now it's true it's getting better and I've seen some music blogs that write in English so that's good but personally from a marketing point of view I don't look where the publication is located I look if it fits the artist of the music he or she is making yeah yeah and I think that speaks to I think that's a great thing for people to know who might be interested in working with you to know that you could work with anyone like location wise like you yes I mean the artists we work with are not based in Ticino so one is in Basel and the other one in Lausanne so yeah we managed to make it work remotely and we obviously meet at the beginning once at least before we agree to work together because you know it's still it's also nice and anytime there's like maybe a big show or something we travel wherever we should travel around Switzerland and we go see them live but yeah overall now we can do most of the work remotely and just have a weekly catch-up call to see how things are going how can people reach you and contact you so through our website which is normamusic.ch we have a contact form which is a small questionnaire in a way so that we can get to know you a bit better before we get on a call or anything and that's the best way otherwise you can also find us on Instagram and Facebook you can send us a message there that is brilliant and also I would say because I've been on your Instagram and it's amazing it's really really good you've got some really helpful tips for people yeah I mean I'm sorry hasn't been updated in a while it's my fault I mean I was going background I was just like and that's why I was like I can't double tap because it looks like but yeah so especially before we officially started being operational I decided to start some sort of Instagram Series where I would touch a topic linked to the music side of things like the business side of Music sorry marketing sometimes as well and just dive a bit deeper into this topic it in a way it was it was a way for us to show people our knowledge so yeah we feel comfortable talking about but at the same time it was also giving insights to artists out there that might want to understand a bit more about a certain topic thank you I'm going to move on to the audience question it's a question from frauaddo @frauddo and the question is very short very simple but actually it's quite an expansive question when I think about it oh my God the question is “how do you stand out?” So what would be your advice to an artist or a band on standing out maybe just getting attention from people very simple answer the first thing I would do is just make really good music so make sure your music is you know well produced a well-mixed and mastered because that's the first thing that it's gonna catch attention. second maybe I'd say work a little bit on your image try to understand what you stand for as an artist what do you want fans to see in you? what you want them to relate to you for? and build your character around that. I'm not saying to come up with something that you feel completely disconnected with it still has to feel natural to you because you're gonna be stuck with it probably for a while and yeah try to work on your messaging your vision and try to find the best ways to express that. Right. That is that's why that is quite concise I thought it'd be like this gotta I mean yeah there could be a lot of answers but this is the first one that came to my mind but I love that because it is concise and it's actionable is something that people can take away and do like a self-audit and go okay is my music at the level it should be? and I'm glad like you mentioned like well mixed and mastered yeah because who wants to listen to music that is not well made in a way you know what I mean it's at the end of the day even The listener needs to be enjoying what they listen to and yeah getting music that is well mixed and mastered is very simple but it's very important why is such an important step and then you went on to say about the image like or what you stand for and then presenting that to people yeah because at the end of the day as an artist you're making music to express yourself express your emotions your thoughts your experiences and so whoever listens to your music or sees you even on a picture or looks at your Instagram needs to understand right away what is that vision and messaging you're trying to get through absolutely yeah I mean it's not maybe the best word but you're creating a brand out of yourself in a way, just trying to put into a clear visual aspect what you represent what how you feel what's what you stand for so yeah the key is yeah use this to create these connections with fans absolutely and then and that's one way of standing out and being a bit different like if you put the time in to consider those things and whereas somebody else may not have that might give you the edge. Aline thank you so much for joining me here today it was been so wonderful to talk to you and for you to share your knowledge with us thank you so so much thank you as well I hope I was helpful and I gave some insights to the listeners and feel free to contact us if you want to discover more about norma music If you want to join the Helvetiarockt community or find out more check out the website, sign up for the newsletter and follow us on social media. If you'd like to support Helvetiarockt you can also become a member or donate and if you like what you heard today please share it with your friends. Helvetiarockt Musicians in Conversation is a concept by Natalia Anderson in collaboration with Helvetiarockt. It's presented and produced by Natalia Anderson music is by Jackie Brutsche and The Jackets.